[Bones McCoy]

Just for clarification; Hitler didn't make the trains run on time - he merely had shot those who contradicted his demonstrably false claims. Also, some of his high-ranking officials tried, unsuccessfully, to kill him, while the others tried, unsuccessfully, to avoid a horde of angry Russian teenagers on speed.

All dictatorships end in failure.

The trains running on time claim was actually originally applied to Mussolini but was, of course, a myth. Even a Fascist dictator cannot control train timetables.
As for the Generals who plotted to assassinate Hitler, their motives were more of pragmatic patriotism (ie Hitler's going to lead Germany to destruction) rather than any high moral principles or political differences, almost all were quite content to swear allegiance and wear the swastika ... until Germany started losing.

I've been enjoying the "We have ways of making you talk" podcast by James "Proper Historian" Holland and Al "Pub Landlord" Murray.

Both are very hot on the numbers and the logistics tale they tell.
Stull that have come out with the opening of archives and discovery of contemporary diaries.

Their take is that the war was decided by 1943 (The allies having stopped the Axis and advancing on all fronts).
All axis powers were suffering resource shortages, and the western allies were ashore in mainland Italy.
Militarily the axis could not win, but politics prevented a rational ceasefire (Shades of that scene form Downfall).

The suitcase plotters, and others, hoped to negotiate an honourable peace - something that had precedent in Aristocratic Prussian history.
The cunts at the top of Germany and Japan are dead set on a Wagnerian end of the world, fight to the last pensioner and child.

I don't think the plotters were any less committed to the Nazi project (at least in 1939-41).
They could read the runes, and see that a major fucking was on its way.

[Philip Marlow]

Fucking hell.

Not very erudite I know, but fucking hell.

[Andy McDandy]

The supporters who really get me are the fundamentalist Christian types who know perfectly well what he’s like but continue to vote for him on the ‘flawed vessel’ basis.

Their adherence to Christian teaching or values seems to come second to a desire to make money and control others - particularly women. They have latched on to Trump not just because he's right wing, but because they know he can be bought. He will do anything for validation, and in return they get to roll out small town Kansas nationwide.

[Philip Marlow]

It would be nice to see it.

[Oboogie]

Just for clarification; Hitler didn't make the trains run on time - he merely had shot those who contradicted his demonstrably false claims. Also, some of his high-ranking officials tried, unsuccessfully, to kill him, while the others tried, unsuccessfully, to avoid a horde of angry Russian teenagers on speed.

All dictatorships end in failure.

The trains running on time claim was actually originally applied to Mussolini but was, of course, a myth. Even a Fascist dictator cannot control train timetables.
As for the Generals who plotted to assassinate Hitler, their motives were more of pragmatic patriotism (ie Hitler's going to lead Germany to destruction) rather than any high moral principles or political differences, almost all were quite content to swear allegiance and wear the swastika ... until Germany started losing.

I've been enjoying the "We have ways of making you talk" podcast by James "Proper Historian" Holland and Al "Pub Landlord" Murray.

Both are very hot on the numbers and the logistics tale they tell.
Stull that have come out with the opening of archives and discovery of contemporary diaries.

Their take is that the war was decided by 1943 (The allies having stopped the Axis and advancing on all fronts).
All axis powers were suffering resource shortages, and the western allies were ashore in mainland Italy.
Militarily the axis could not win, but politics prevented a rational ceasefire (Shades of that scene form Downfall).

The suitcase plotters, and others, hoped to negotiate an honourable peace - something that had precedent in Aristocratic Prussian history.
The cunts at the top of Germany and Japan are dead set on a Wagnerian end of the world, fight to the last pensioner and child.

I don't think the plotters were any less committed to the Nazi project (at least in 1939-41).
They could read the runes, and see that a major fucking was on its way.

I also enjoy that podcast.
1943 as the turning point is unusually late though, commonly Alamein and Stalingrad are cited and many historians now agree that Barbarossa was when Hitler guaranteed Germany's defeat, with the declaration of war on the USA merely bringing that defeat forward by a few years.
I forget the source, but I recently heard someone making a persuasive case that any chance of a Nazi victory was sealed the day Britain declared war because land focussed Germany lacked the capacity to defeat Britain, let alone the Empire. I think it's now pretty well established that Hitler didn't believe France and Britain would go to war over Poland and he would have another couple of years to build up his forces before hostilities commenced.

[Crabcakes]

Fucking hell.

Not very erudite I know, but fucking hell.

Indeed. As someone with a school-age child, I again find myself bewildered anyone wishes to raise children in the USA, and that an allegedly civilised society cannot muster the energy to do something about this.

[davidjay]

Fuck, that's a hard watch.

[Bones McCoy]

The trains running on time claim was actually originally applied to Mussolini but was, of course, a myth. Even a Fascist dictator cannot control train timetables.
As for the Generals who plotted to assassinate Hitler, their motives were more of pragmatic patriotism (ie Hitler's going to lead Germany to destruction) rather than any high moral principles or political differences, almost all were quite content to swear allegiance and wear the swastika ... until Germany started losing.

I've been enjoying the "We have ways of making you talk" podcast by James "Proper Historian" Holland and Al "Pub Landlord" Murray.

Both are very hot on the numbers and the logistics tale they tell.
Stull that have come out with the opening of archives and discovery of contemporary diaries.

Their take is that the war was decided by 1943 (The allies having stopped the Axis and advancing on all fronts).
All axis powers were suffering resource shortages, and the western allies were ashore in mainland Italy.
Militarily the axis could not win, but politics prevented a rational ceasefire (Shades of that scene form Downfall).

The suitcase plotters, and others, hoped to negotiate an honourable peace - something that had precedent in Aristocratic Prussian history.
The cunts at the top of Germany and Japan are dead set on a Wagnerian end of the world, fight to the last pensioner and child.

I don't think the plotters were any less committed to the Nazi project (at least in 1939-41).
They could read the runes, and see that a major fucking was on its way.

I also enjoy that podcast.
1943 as the turning point is unusually late though, commonly Alamein and Stalingrad are cited and many historians now agree that Barbarossa was when Hitler guaranteed Germany's defeat, with the declaration of war on the USA merely bringing that defeat forward by a few years.
I forget the source, but I recently heard someone making a persuasive case that any chance of a Nazi victory was sealed the day Britain declared war because land focussed Germany lacked the capacity to defeat Britain, let alone the Empire. I think it's now pretty well established that Hitler didn't believe France and Britain would go to war over Poland and he would have another couple of years to build up his forces before hostilities commenced.

I don't recall the precise wording on 1943 as "end is nigh" time.
Probably something along the lines of "it was apparent to almost anybody in the know"..

'43 sees the results of Stalingrad and Alamein coming home to roost.
The German 6th? army captured in their biggest mass surender.
Soon after the record broken as the Jerries are bounced out of Africa.
The American strategic bomber forces start arriving in Europe and learning their trade (the hard way).

Over in the Pacific the Japanese are stopped in the Solomons, and the Marines steal their airfield.
This kingpin was supposed to operate the long range aircraft to Isolate Australia form the USA.
Now it's a springboard to roll the Japs out of the Solomons and provide a free run for the naval Island hopping campaign.

[Arrowhead]

These sorts of numbers are what make me cautiously optimistic for the upcoming election:

[Abernathy]

You know what makes me nervous? This( valid, I think) point of view that says that if Harris wins, it needs to be by a very clear and emphatic margin, in order to render any repeat of Trump's 2020 shenanigans about rigged and stolen elections pointless and redundant. Spike the bastard's guns, if you will. But the opinion polling is on a knife-edge, has been for months, and is suggestive of anything but a clear and emphatic margin of victory if/when Harris wins. Which means that as things stand, we are more or less guaranteed a re-run of Trump's disgraceful behaviour at the 2020 election. I'm fairly sure the bastard has been actively preparing for it for months, if not years. The last thing anybody needs is a second American civil war,

[Malcolm Armsteen]

Failed state. What do you expect?

[Andy McDandy]

Not so sure it will happen. For one, they're expecting it and will have the countermeasures in place. Two, the cunt no longer has the embedded position he had in 2021. Three, I think we need to start separating his fans into the true believers and the, for want of a better word, tourists.

Meanwhile the media needs to learn to ignore him outside of campaign times. Timeshare salesman says something stupid is not news.

[Oboogie]

The only way there can be a re-run of Jan 6th is if Biden allows it by ordering the police, National Guard etc not to intervene. I can't think of any circumstances in which he would do that.

[Malcolm Armsteen]

It's about time the USA got rid of those fucking stupid first and second amendments - but they won't, as they are now a fetish.

Part of the reason they are a failed state - along with evangelical Christianity and the 'frontier spirit'.

[Philip Marlow]

Fuck, that's a hard watch.

One of those occasions when I wish that a) I believed in a hell and b) that it had many, many more fires for Alex Jones to roast in.

And now, from the files of shite celebrity endorsements…

I may be feeling less than charitable because I’ve been finding him tiresome since the days when he was doing Ali G on The Eleven O’Clock Show, but the sexy-sexy-times-from-Kazakhstan routine reminds me of the bit in Wag the Dog when De Niro and Hoffman’s characters agree that the fake war they’re cooking up should be against Albania because the vast majority of the American public knows absolutely fuck all about the place.

[Youngian]

The toe curling chaeacter was created at the tail end of the analogue age, Sasha BC essentially put a pin in the map to choose a country no one has heard of and they would never hear of him. What could go wrong?

[Andy McDandy]

A relic of the post-Brass Eye "fuck you" period of British comedy.

[Abernathy]

Not so sure it will happen. For one, they're expecting it and will have the countermeasures in place. Two, the cunt no longer has the embedded position he had in 2021.

So how do you see it possibly playing out? An attempted insurrection by armed Trumpists being bloodily put down by the National Guard?

My feeling is that the so-called "Proud Boys" etc, though they do of course have (constitutionally approved) guns, are substantially just full of piss and wind, and will be crushed swiftly in the fashion of Keir Starmer dealing briskly with the Farage rioters.

Three, I think we need to start separating his fans into the true believers and the, for want of a better word, tourists.

Not sure what this means. Can you expand?

Meanwhile the media needs to learn to ignore him outside of campaign times. Timeshare salesman says something stupid is not news.

Seen.

[Andy McDandy]

Some of his supporters are out and out cunts. Whether it's small government, aggressive diplomacy, fundie Christianity, low taxes, old fashioned racism or all of the above, it doesn't matter. Point out his incompetence and if they don't flatly deny it, they'll embrace it. Less oversight, more power at the state or local level. Yay.

Some others though, I sense are the tourists. They're caught up in the campaign momentum, they love the guy on stage saying crazy shit. They're the ones Alan Moore described (see Guardian thread) as treating elections like Saturday night TV vote-offs. For those, it's all a big game and they're just too shallow to understand it's not.

As for another January 6th, they were caught off guard. I'd imagine that the FBI and co are keeping tabs on Internet chatter, and are poised to make a few visits in the case that Cunt Features doesn't look like going quietly.

[Tubby Isaacs]

There's also lots who just always vote Republican, and like Trump less than their generic congressman who supported McCain and Romney too. They might vote for an American Lib Dems (with a different name) but they're not voting Democrat.