[Crabcakes]

The all powerful and omnipresent cult has spoken, all dissent will be crushed.

Fuck this, cya

Yep, that’s us. Or - and I’m just throwing this crazy idea out there - maybe you’re just wrong?

Piers Corbyn, David Icke, Trump, Nigel Lawson, Hitchens, Littlejohn…all the people with big egos, arrogance for days, a need to feel special and superior, and usually with business interests that rely on the status quo to keep the money rolling in. That’s quite the company to keep.

[kreuzberger]

Fuck this, cya

Oh well, that is quite a shame. MaM is a good man but, if you come to MW and chat utter dogshit, it is entirely likely that you're going to be challenged.

Tomorrow is another day.

[Abernathy]

Well, that turned out well, didn’t it ?

Seems MAM does not deal well with facts and rational argument.

Hello again and goodbye again, MAM.

[Crabcakes]

I’ve no desire whatsoever to drive people away, but I’ve also no desire to leave my daughter an uninhabitable planet. If that means zero tolerance to people choosing to insulate themselves from responsibility through wilful ignorance, so be it.

[mattomac]

I’d love to know who these incompetent all powerful people are, so far they seem to have only been able to win Biden one election, climate change, the rise of the far right, Brexit.

They can’t stop anything the useless fools

[Nigredo]

Ooops

I do wonder if there's a particular enclave of skepticism in the UK, specifically the question about whether temperature rises are artificially accelerated because the UK's geography means (for now) it will see milder climate change than most places.

Before the coastline recedes inwards by about 100 miles, it'll mostly remain green and pleasant here and people's experience of climate change will be the tens of thousands of refugees fleeing their homeland because whether it's rising heat, polluted water, or soil degradation, it is simply not habitable anymore. But so long as there's still tea and fruit scones being served in Ludlow it's all much fuss about nothing.

[Boiler]

But so long as there's still tea and fruit scones being served in Ludlow it's all much fuss about nothing.

Just don't try charging your EV there.

[Mr angry Manchester]

My issue on this point is not so much the subject itself but more the way that it is being force fed constantly.

To me, it is part of the disconnect between the political liberal elite and the rest of the population. Out here, in scroteland, where I live, a lot of people think that this is either;

1, Made up manufactured bollocks

2, An element of a problem but massively exaggerated (my opinion)

3, A gigantic scam to control the minds of the masses and/or get money out of people

Propaganda can have a negative effect, and hyperbole can too, it's being seen as a kind of middle class obsession preventing working class people from doing their jobs, and being told that your boiler will have to be replaced by some very costly green alternative.

In general, people don't like being told what to do, it's not good politics. There seems to be an unwillingness by environmental campaigners to compromise. Fighting the weather doesn't usually work, King Canute thought he could stop the tide coming in and the silly twat just got wet.

Finally, me, who isn't into this green stuff actually practises what the greens preach, cycling, public transport use, recycling, not consuming very much.

Maybe I have the smallest carbon footprint on here?

[The Weeping Angel]

No it's called scientific fact.

[Andy McDandy]

Canute was pointing out his powerlessness in the face of nature.

[The Weeping Angel]

I mean sure on the one hand there's all this science which proves that the Earth is warming up and we need to do something about greenhouse gases or the world will experience more floods, droughts and other extreme weather which will lead to refugees, wars and other crisis. On the other hand people in scrote land think it's nonsense. Now who to believe? It's a tough one but I'm going with the science.

[Mr angry Manchester]

You're missing the point again. I'm NOT arguing that it's not happening, I'm arguing that it's being over egged and force fed and people outside the little elite bubble are getting sick of hearing about it.

This turns people off it and has a negative effect.

[The Weeping Angel]

Except it isn't being over egged. If you want to be a climate change denier fine but don't come crying to me when your house is flooded because of extreme weather. Oh and actually public concern has risen in the last couple of years has actually risen. Now why would that be?

[kreuzberger]

The is a reason why it is called a "Climate Emergency" rather than a "Climate Issue Which We Might Kinda Think About After Strictly-Come-Baking-On-Ice".

Moreover, nobody is being forced to do anything. Governments across the world are under-egging the blindingly obvious with the exception of those whose countries are already experience the early blasts of the changes which will befall everyone, sooner or later. The cruel irony is that they are the least powerful or equipped to effect any meaningful change.

I suppose I will be dismissed as a bubble-dwelling "elite" for condescending to challenge the self-appointed salt of the earth. I grew up in a council house, eating jam sandwiches for tea, while my mum claimed to be "on a diet".

[Cyclist]

I think I understand Mr angry's position. It's not that he doesn't believe it's happening - he's already told us he knows it is - it's that for him, and thousands of others, there are more pressing concerns. You can't expect someone to wholeheartedly buy in to something like going green to save the planet when they're worried sick about paying the bills, putting food on the table, getting the kids off to school in clothes that fit and shoes that don't leak. The stuff most of us forumites take for granted. Eleven years of Tory policies has brought that level of poverty back. And it's true that nearly all of the climate change stuff is coming from people who don't have to worry about missing meals to pay the electricity bill. Plus, of course, not liking being told what to do is an actual thing. And when you're barely scraping by on minimum wage the last thing you want is well-off people with nice cars and foreign holidays lecturing you about how to live your life.

These are my first half-formed thoughts. I'll post more when I've had time to think properly. Time to remember when I was on the breadline and robbing Peter to pay Paul every month. I *do* remember that global issues fade into the background when you're on the skids.

[The Weeping Angel]

I'll freely admit that I have a lot of issues with the green movement from their opposistion to nuclear power to the cretinous behaviour of the likes of XR and Insulate Britain but my problem with the view of MAM is the denialism sure he says he accepts the science but he's basically he doesn't think it's a problem and dismisses any attempt to deal with the problem.

[satnav]

I saw this nonsense doing the round on Twitter at the weekend.



There really is some twaddle in there. I do remember walking to school when I was younger because back then you went to the nearest school in your area rather than parents bending over backwards to get their kids into the best school in the area.
I didn't go on a package holiday until I was 16 because until then we couldn't afford such holidays. Doing things because there is no real alternative is not being green. I can also remember that nearly every house in our village had coal fires because we lived in a mining village. Most of the cars my dad owned were old bangers.

Plastic bags were used a lot in the 70's and If large supermarkets had existed when I was a child I'm sure my parents would have used them.

Most teenagers are better informed about environmental issues than teenagers were in the past and I think they have every right to complain about the damage that has been caused to the environment over the last 40 or 50 years.

[kreuzberger]

Yebbut, all of this is now blood under the bridge. The climate doesn't care whose fault it was, and it certainly doesn't give a shit about who is responsible for the procrastination. The climate emergency is the climate emergency and pop bottles really are just a side issue.

Boomers, with their tedious and irrelevant nostalgia, are depressingly boring.

[Bones McCoy]

Nuffink to do with us, it's those bloody kids with their Iphones.

[mattomac]

I saw this nonsense doing the round on Twitter at the weekend.



There really is some twaddle in there. I do remember walking to school when I was younger because back then you went to the nearest school in your area rather than parents bending over backwards to get their kids into the best school in the area.
I didn't go on a package holiday until I was 16 because until then we couldn't afford such holidays. Doing things because there is no real alternative is not being green. I can also remember that nearly every house in our village had coal fires because we lived in a mining village. Most of the cars my dad owned were old bangers.

Plastic bags were used a lot in the 70's and If large supermarkets had existed when I was a child I'm sure my parents would have used them.

Most teenagers are better informed about environmental issues than teenagers were in the past and I think they have every right to complain about the damage that has been caused to the environment over the last 40 or 50 years.

That is absolute bullshit (not you).

We had the pop man and the milk man, we holidayed in Britain as you said all my dads cars were second hand and last owner types which were driven into the ground (luckily he knows his way around cars and other stuff or they would have gone a lot sooner).

What drove plastic usage was big corporations that out did the smaller businesses, supermarkets and the like. In fact I don’t think I drank from a plastic bottle til my late teens (not 500ml)

I make the pop man point to my mum a fair bit when we chat about it.