Mailwatch(ed) Forum

It would be an odd rule as, how someone voted can never be proven.

Alastair Campbell was expelled for voting LibDem in the European Elections in 2019 on the grounds that he was influencing others to vote for another party. Initially he contested it on the grounds he didn't make the fact public until after the polls had closed and therefore influenced nobody but Labour refused to back down as, apparently, voting for another party was grounds for expulsion. However it was never tested in court, Campbell saying he no longer wished to be a member anyway.

An interesting piece by the formidable Emma Burnell:

https://softleft.substack.com/p/faction ... irect=true

Oboogie wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 11:40 pm It would be an odd rule as, how someone voted can never be proven.

Alastair Campbell was expelled for voting LibDem in the European Elections in 2019 on the grounds that he was influencing others to vote for another party. Initially he contested it on the grounds he didn't make the fact public until after the polls had closed and therefore influenced nobody but Labour refused to back down as, apparently, voting for another party was grounds for expulsion. However it was never tested in court, Campbell saying he no longer wished to be a member anyway.

In solidarity with Alastair (though I couldn't know it at the time) I voted Lib Dem in those European Parliament elections as well, \nd made no secret of it. Labour's position at the time under Corbyn was confused and hopeless. Nobody came after me to expel me.

Ditto in Carshalton and Wallington parliamentaries. We are on about 15% and have a candidate who 'may be able' to attend a meeting with the membership... He was chosen from the NEC list, not by interview. There is no constituency plan of action yet, though that is partly due to the lack of talent among the Corbynist rump still in charge.

The message from Party HQ is clear, go and work in Croydon and Mitcham, where we are winners, and leave C&W to the Lib Dems, who have worked the seat hard for years.

GTTO

Abernathy wrote: ↑Fri May 31, 2024 9:35 am

Oboogie wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 11:40 pm It would be an odd rule as, how someone voted can never be proven.

Alastair Campbell was expelled for voting LibDem in the European Elections in 2019 on the grounds that he was influencing others to vote for another party. Initially he contested it on the grounds he didn't make the fact public until after the polls had closed and therefore influenced nobody but Labour refused to back down as, apparently, voting for another party was grounds for expulsion. However it was never tested in court, Campbell saying he no longer wished to be a member anyway.

In solidarity with Alastair (though I couldn't know it at the time) I voted Lib Dem in those European Parliament elections as well, \nd made no secret of it. Labour's position at the time under Corbyn was confused and hopeless. Nobody came after me to expel me.

Yes, I also voted LibDem in the European Election as a protest against Corbyn's absurd position - the only time I've ever voted anything but Labour.

Voted Lib Dem in the European and General Election in 2019. I was in a safe seat, and didn’t fancy being cited again as a vote for Corbynism or whatever.

What a shambles that period was. The Tories lost voters to the Brexit Party, and got someone in who could get them back. Labour lost votes to the Lib Dems and stuck with the leader as far away from Lib Dem as they could get.

Well, Jez's mates fixed Bassetlaw for their preferred candidate. But I agree the amount of fixing has been too high this time, even allowing for the snap election, though I suppose Labour got stuck with some dreadful locally selected candidates from the Jez era.

One of the fixes Beth moans about there (Swansea West) is Torsten Bell, formerly of the Resolution Foundation. I can certainly live with that.

"Insult to Wales", apparently. Rather than to a fairly small group of people in two constituencies.

I don' t think Starmer "pledged" (not that that matters) not to place candidates in short order whe na snap election is announced.

Faiza Shaheen is running as an independent. Sally Gimson and Jas Athwal who were hard done by under Corbyn didn't run as independents. Nor to their credit are Lloyd Russell Moyle, Beth Winter or Mick Whitley. The Green Party are already running in Woodford Green and Chingford. so there's no need for Shaheen to run to "offer an alternative to the 2 main parties", as she puts it.

The ego has landed.

Shaheen may well have thrown one of the most egregious and despicable Tories around a completely undeserved lifeline. And for what? Basically, for the sake of vanity.

I think she probably thinks she can win, or at least come second and then say "Labour split my vote". But Jamies Driscoll lost by 13%, with a more engaged electorate (mayoral, rather than general election), and there was virtually no danger of the Tories winning that. It's easy to mistake lots of people saying "you should run" for the general state of opinion. National polls may be a better indicator of that. I keep getting told by Greens in my constituency that even though they came fourth last time, and have been going nowhere in national polls, whereas Labour are up by a lot, that they're definitely going to come second because of Ellie Chowns, their candidate.

I guess we'll see about Faiza Shaheen and Ellie Chowns on 4 July.

North Herefordshire got a mention by Campbell and Stewart reviewing target Green seats. Is this a middle class yoghurt weaver demographic plus disgruntled NIMBYs?

Leominster? They drink the blood of their dead.

Youngian wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 7:42 pm North Herefordshire got a mention by Campbell and Stewart reviewing target Green seats. Is this a middle class yoghurt weaver demographic plus disgruntled NIMBYs?

I expect that's a lot of it, particularly in the villages (which are very affluent, like ours). Of the towns, as Andy says, Leominster isn't posh, and there's a lot of social housing (or ex social housing at least) in Ledbury. I'd expect Labour to beat the Greens among the poorer and/or less engaged voters.

More confident than me.

My memory has faded but didn’t Corbyn put in pretty good performances in his leadership debates? And reasonably gaffe free campaigns.

He definitely didn’t say that if he were PM he would push the red Trident button.

Youngian wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 8:47 pm My memory has faded but didn’t Corbyn put in pretty good performances in his leadership debates? And reasonably gaffe free campaigns.

In 2017, I think the only "gaffe" was a (perfectly reasonable) promise to review council tax, which the Tories leapt on as a "garden tax". I don't know if he dropped it or successfully minimised the damage from it. But he was surprisingly effective overall in the campaign.