[Andy McDandy]

Also, it's easy. Take any right wing commentator and boil their stuff down and you end up with one message - "Stop telling me what to do*".

*With my money, what to say, how to behave, how to take care of myself, which laws to obey etc.

[mattomac]

You had Andrew Neill pontificating on his new show how will Labour ever afford this stuff with Ed Balls actually joining in while Osborne sat to his left.

Seriously garbage.

[Youngian]

You cannot, no matter how hard you try, get it through to these people that it's far, far harder for Labour to win an election than the Tories. Not only do they have to battle against a biased media and a totally outdated electoral system, but all the Tories have to do is to convince their voters that they're better than Them - whether that be better off, harder working, whiter, more British. Meanwhile, Labour have got to win over the Brexity xenophobe in Hartlepool, the aspirational professional in Clerkenwell, a host of mortgage-paying, two income but still struggling Middle Englanders. And to win those votes they have to, at times, say different things to different people and shake hands with some who they'd rather not touch with a bargepole. That's grown-up politics.

Once in government, Labour will also be crucified for the slightest mistake. Whereas the Tories can destroy the economy and loot the state before they lose a few points.

[Tubby Isaacs]

I went to a Prep School for 2 years. These characteristics don't ring many bells with me.

Apparently nobody in the article says the headline.

[Bones McCoy]

Mail Lying about Starmer (again).

It must be a Monday.

[Tubby Isaacs]

Like when they made out Milliband went to a posh state school.

The school has lots of council estates by it. It isn't posh now, and it wouldn't have been pre-Right To Buy, I'm sure.

[Andy McDandy]

Starmer has a new tactic at PMQs - finish on a genuine-sounding question about something non-partisan and of actual concern (today it was kids contracting Strep A). Bingo, Sunak can't go into his standard no-reply speech.

[Youngian]

Tory backbenchers are now so easily pleased Sunak has a very low bar to clear to rally them. ‘Starmer smells of poo’ would do.

[Tubby Isaacs]

Starmer has a new tactic at PMQs - finish on a genuine-sounding question about something non-partisan and of actual concern (today it was kids contracting Strep A). Bingo, Sunak can't go into his standard no-reply speech.

Just nicked that.

[Nigredo]

Unsure if this will load, I may have to copy this diatribe from Another Angry Voice over to pastebin. But it is something to behold.

https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php? ... %2CO%2CP-R

[Abernathy]

Unsure if this will load, I may have to copy this diatribe from Another Angry Voice over to pastebin. But it is something to behold.

https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php? ... %2CO%2CP-R

Another Angry Wank. Just what is "siding with British workers" any way? Picket line selfies? It's complete bollocks to claim that Labour doesn't support workers seeking improvements to pay and conditions. Labour has always supported the right to withdraw Labour , and always will, but Starmer's position on the matter is clearly and repeatedly stated. Labour seeks to govern, and as the governmenti it will have a responsibility and a commitment to avoid groups of workers having to go on strike, and to work to resolve such disputes if and when they occur. Performative picket line posturing will do absolutely nothing to achieve any of these goals, and in opposition, could actually harm Labour's chances of returning to government by pulling off the still mammoth task bequeathed by Corbyn in 2019.

[Andy McDandy]

Quite. They seem to view rebuilding the Corbyn coalition of a few thousand assorted cranks as more important than winning over the millions in the middle.

[Crabcakes]

I’m consistently staggered at the bizarre ability some people have to extrapolate the best, most forgiving and generous interpretation of something Corbyn did that was 100% at odds with every action he’s ever taken, while assuming something Starmer says now that’s open to interpretation (but clearly aimed at not winding up people who may still be wary about voting Labour) is 100% definitely a sign he’s a hardcore leave Tory in disguise.

It’s like they’re oblivious to the fact a rigged game must be played first. Yes it’s shit, but Jez’s huffy ‘not playing’ tactic hardly delivered…

[mattomac]

I think it demonstrates how far left they believed they had gone, if you look at the manifesto there isn’t a lot that you wouldn’t expect Starmer to do, bar the absolute barmy.

Though as demonstrated during the leadership contest of 2016, they would probably come up with 10 policies Corbyn never promised and claim he did.

I remember one having a go at Smith and turned around and cheered a policy of “Corbyn’s”, I couldn’t be arsed to raise the point it was Owen Smith’s not Corbyn’s.

At that point I think I’d gone on strike.

Not sure why Owen Jones and the like hate the idea of Starmer, they will probably get more invites, someone has to replace the disgruntled Tories on the TV.

[The Weeping Angel]

Unsure if this will load, I may have to copy this diatribe from Another Angry Voice over to pastebin. But it is something to behold.

https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php? ... %2CO%2CP-R

Fuck me that is deranged.

[Oboogie]

Unsure if this will load, I may have to copy this diatribe from Another Angry Voice over to pastebin. But it is something to behold.

https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php? ... %2CO%2CP-R

Fuck me that is deranged.

I didn't know he was still going, I've not read him for years. It's pretty special, I wonder how many of his followers believe him?

[Bones McCoy]

Unsure if this will load, I may have to copy this diatribe from Another Angry Voice over to pastebin. But it is something to behold.

https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php? ... %2CO%2CP-R

Fuck me that is deranged.

It's what the Internet and A Night at the Opera have in common.

"There ain't no sanity clause".

[Nigredo]

I’m consistently staggered at the bizarre ability some people have to extrapolate the best, most forgiving and generous interpretation of something Corbyn did that was 100% at odds with every action he’s ever taken, while assuming something Starmer says now that’s open to interpretation (but clearly aimed at not winding up people who may still be wary about voting Labour) is 100% definitely a sign he’s a hardcore leave Tory in disguise.

It’s like they’re oblivious to the fact a rigged game must be played first. Yes it’s shit, but Jez’s huffy ‘not playing’ tactic hardly delivered…

What rankles me is they still adhere to the absurd myth of "centrist red Tories stabbing Labour in the back!", as if this doesn't undermine their whole argument about Magic Grandad's popularity and status as "a great unifier of the left". And in the very next sentence they will bemoan that none of the important positions in the party are occupied by a "tr00 soshuhlist!" like it was in 2019...

[Crabcakes]

You can easily see Corbyn as a great unifier of the left if you define everyone not as left as you as right wing.

In fact, for the Jezzerati that’s a fairly tame bit of mental gymnastics compared to some of the contortions they inflict on themselves…

[Tubby Isaacs]

This sort of stuff is getting on my nerves a bit at the moment.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... ld-back-it

The Guardian view on proportional representation: Labour should back it

I'd certainly prefer PR, but there's no way it could be brought in without a referendum. The AV referendum, though some time ago, didn't suggest "we want proper PR" to me. No mention of referendums in this article. As we know from bitter experience, referendums aren't fought purely on the question in hand, and losing them is a massive problem for the Prime Minister. Arguably Starmer might need to resign.

It would be nice if more people at least recognised this, instead of snooty pronunciations like "Labour sees electoral reform as at best a distraction."