Mailwatch(ed) Forum

I think we may at last have located an accusation so insultingly thin that not even the press is particularly interested.

What are people's thoughts on this?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/ar ... ent-scheme

But a government spokesperson said this was not being looked at. “We are not considering it, there are no plans for this, or any work being done on it,” they said.

Asked whether the issue might come up in future talks with the EU, they said: “Our negotiating team has very clear red lines, and none of the preparatory work involves this.”

While Labour has been adamant it will never oversee a return to the free movement of people, the idea of a youth mobility scheme – which would allow EU citizens under 30 to work and study for a fixed period in the UK, and vice-versa – would be more similar to deals the UK has with countries such as Australia.

In April, the EU made a formal offer to negotiate a bloc-wide youth mobility programme, but this was immediately rejected by both Labour and Rishi Sunak, who was the Conservative prime minister at the time.

According to sources, the offer, which came out of the blue, was an attempt by the European Commission to quash a bid by the UK to do unilateral deals with six countries, including France, Spain and Germany.

The French, in particular, were adamant that the UK should not be allowed to “cherry pick” EU access post-Brexit.

Another apparent obstacle to the EU proposal is the element that would allow UK and EU students to have home-fee status again at each others’ universities for four years.

They've had a hammering for this today, but I'm not particularly concerned yet. As that article says, there's a dispute within the EU about whether this is an EU matter at all. If it's going to be bilateral deals, then different countries have different interests. I thought this was interesting by a very good poster on the Guardian:

https://profile.theguardian.com/user/id ... 972?page=1

Talking from an Italian perspective there would be still a huge popular demand for a bilateral deal with the UK. It's a great frustration to our younger population that they can't easily live in London (mostly for 2-3 years) and we hugely value the contribution that English retirees bring to us. We are honest that we never obtained substantial numbers of young britons moving to us during the pre-brexit years.

That would seem like a very easily sellable deal on both sides. The same deal for Bulgarians (are they the poorest EU member?) is much harder to sell in the UK. So presumably the UK would ask for stuff that Italy was less happy with, and it gets compiicated. But it's not all along rich/poor lines (counting Italy as rich might be a stretch anyway), and it says France are strongly in favour of the whole bloc approach.

Where I am worried is in terms of politics. Labour doesn't seem to be as worried as it should be about giving space to the Greens, and this is something where they need to look less negative. Maybe it'll all work out in the negotiations.

Philip Marlow wrote: ↑Wed Aug 21, 2024 2:34 pm I think we may at last have located an accusation so insultingly thin that not even the press is particularly interested.

I didn't know Alex Hearn were with that lot. I've seen him say sensible things.

From a Germany correspondent.

‪Ryan Walshaw‬ ‪@ryanwalshaw.bsky.social‬
Reply to
David Henig
This will go down particularly badly with Berlin - it is consistently raised in the papers as a top priority in resetting the relationship with the UK
As such it’s the main thing their man in London has been lobbying on for months. As you say, first big vibes test failed

Seems like the German position is for a bloc-wide deal. But we can probably overdo the importance of the first test of "vibes". German public opinion doesn't seem particularly favourable to poorer EU members (certainly not poorer Eurozone ones). Would they turn down bilaterals in solidarity with those same countries?

Problem is its age restrictive, we talk of people working well in to their 70s but the mindset hasn’t shifted of effectively being done at 40.

And you can talk about the idea of settling down but again it’s increasingly talking to generations who are already done.

If it was 18-60 then so be it but I think limited agreements like this don’t really work. My skill set is transferable across borders if I learnt the language to a decent level.

Yeah, and we talk about lifelong learning. That might well involve a 40 year old moving to the UK (as it would disproportionately be). I guess you mobility is considered easier to sell to the UK politically. But I can see why the Governent is wary.

Tubby Isaacs wrote: ↑Thu Aug 22, 2024 10:35 pm From a Germany correspondent.

‪Ryan Walshaw‬ ‪@ryanwalshaw.bsky.social‬
Reply to
David Henig
This will go down particularly badly with Berlin - it is consistently raised in the papers as a top priority in resetting the relationship with the UK
As such it’s the main thing their man in London has been lobbying on for months. As you say, first big vibes test failed

Seems like the German position is for a bloc-wide deal. But we can probably overdo the importance of the first test of "vibes". German public opinion doesn't seem particularly favourable to poorer EU members (certainly not poorer Eurozone ones). Would they turn down bilaterals in solidarity with those same countries?

Having 27 bilateral deals is no difference in practice to having an EU treaty on FoM apart from British voters are too thick to understand that. You just have to sign the Romanian agreement on a busier news day than the Spanish one.

Scandal.

An unnecessary own goal, even if it’s just bad optics the press is going to pull ‘they’re all the same’ card to help the Tories wipe the slate clean. Buying Starmer glasses is a bit of a weird titbit.

I am still at a loss to understand why a having pass is a Bad Thing, claiming star-billing in a national newspaper. (A spex scandal - baddoom tish...)

Looks like we’ve thankfully returned to a more normal era when government ‘scandal’ is just courtier gossip and tittle tattle rivalries.

As Daniel FInklestein points out this is a something of nothing scandal.

Good.

The prime minister has scrapped a government helicopter contract - thought to be worth £40m.

Rishi Sunak was criticised for his use of helicopters during his time in No 10.

The contract was set to be renewed, but is now being scrapped by Downing Street and the Ministry of Defence.

It is designed to illustrate a break with the previous administration - ahead of a speech in which the prime minister will argue things will not be "business as usual" when parliament returns next week.

Rishi Sunak used RAF jets and helicopters for domestic flights more frequently than the UK's previous three prime ministers, a BBC investigation found in 2023.

Speaking about the cancellation, a Labour source said that the "Tories' VIP helicopter service" was a "grossly wasteful" symbol of their government that was "totally out of touch with the problems facing the rest of the country".

"It's only right that this service is brought to an end," the source added, claiming that the government is "getting a grip of the public finances."

They said: "It tells you everything that, on top of the £22 billion black hole that the Tories were blowing in the public finances, Rishi Sunak's priority was keeping his VIP helicopter service...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c7853gq38p1o.amp

Keep doing this stuff, and keep shouting about it. "The mess we inherited", but with evidence to back it up - something that was in short supply when the Tories said it.

The Weeping Angel wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2024 10:11 pm As Daniel FInklestein points out this is a something of nothing scandal.

That's a fair point. He is a Parliamentarian. I don't know if he has any sort of unpaid title, but wouldn't be hard to create one. Presumably that would make it all OK in the eyes of the people calling this a scandal?

It's desperate stuff and getting no traction. Most of the electorate isn't as stupid as Dacre thinks they are.

Dacre's really going for "middle class tax hikes" on the back of Reeves saying inheritance tax and capital gains tax may have to rise. Do most middle class people have shares or second homes? As for inheritance, the rate doesn't even need to rise for more money to be raised from it. There are lots of allowances that are claimed mostly by very rich people which mean that they pay a lower percentage on inheritance than somebody selling a house in the South East (not that I particularly care about that either, you understand).

The Guardian's been hitting the Government a lot on youth mobility. Yeah, Starmer! If you can't rejoin the EU now, just sign up to youth mobility! It's not even clear whether it's an EU competency or a member state one. And anyway, while it's easy to say Britons should move to Bulgaria for education value, the fact is very few want to. So it's understandable that the UK would hardball this and try and get other things in the meantime.

Nearly all government’s get the shitty decisions out of the way asap. Voters have the political memory of a guppy fish unless a new administration loses control of the economy and it costs them (Liz Truss, Norman Lamont).

And never let a crisis go to waste. Somebody ought to have restricted and restructured winter fuel allowance ages ago. If Labour gets it right, then going to be hard for the Tories to bring them back in their current universal form, you'd think. Same with inheritance tax. I thought the Tories would abolish it or cut it, but they didn't. Was that purely Sunak in sane mode thing? Maybe, but I'd be surprised if they hadn't realised that it's not as good a card as their media pals think.

Youngian wrote: ↑Wed Aug 28, 2024 7:48 pm Nearly all government’s get the shitty decisions out of the way asap. Voters have the political memory of a guppy fish unless a new administration loses control of the economy and it costs them (Liz Truss, Norman Lamont).

Too true, my friend. Cast your mind back to 2010, if you will. Ministers from the Cameron-Clegg coalition were so well-drilled in every single media appearance, they never failed, without exception, to use repeatedly, the phrase “the mess we inherited”. Every. Fucking. Time.

Now when Rachel Reeves and Keir Starmer say more or less the same thing, they get no end of stick for it.
Fucking hypocrites.