Mailwatch(ed) Forum

Tubby Isaacs wrote: ↑Sun Jul 23, 2023 9:47 pm
Sure, as someone who ran against them in a general election, he might not be the best messenger, but the response BTL is as bad as you'd expect.

Some of the replies are what Tristram Hunt would have got back telling a few home truths on a Momentum site. This is an insightful take but needs post Corbyn update about Labour

Tired and Emotional
2y
The problem with all this is that the Labour Party is not well placed to pickup support form this kind of discontent. Swingers of this sort must by definition have considered voting Conservative or be in a demographic that previously has so they will not be public sector unionised middlings .
We are talking about private sector professionals of various sorts in finance tech media and so on. They may well despise the sheer stupidity of Brexit, detest the low grade cultural pollution of its xenophobia and find its far right knuckle dragging allies shameful.
Nonetheless they either are, or aspire to be high earning home owners .
Labour has nothing for Mr and Mrs Get Ahead , but bills, finger wagging, and a sort of hard left politics they find not so much abhorrent as mystifying
You may think the Express is for dim old bigots but that does not a Labour voter make.

Ha ha,

The kind of point of swing voters is that they've voted for other people. I believe the Tories got a few in 2019.

In fairness, that bit on aspiration was written before Lee Anderson started banging on about 30p baked beans....

More like swinging between Labour, Lib-Dem’s, Green’s than going anywhere near ToryKip

The most angry and disparaging about the Tories seem to be the 35-50s

Even David Brent would only say this for a laugh. Frost isn’t really this stupid. Brain dead morons are the only people he has left to back his political ambitions.

About all we’re missing is Frosty turning up in the Lords with shades and a beach ball.

mattomac wrote: ↑Mon Jul 24, 2023 11:03 pm The most angry and disparaging about the Tories seem to be the 35-50s

Given I fit in that bracket, I can tell you why - we grew up under Thatcher and Major, we saw how society could be better, and then (and I massively generalise here, so apologies) after Blair gifted the right a way back because of his war adventure many of our parents decided they wanted us to be worse off to service their own prejudices or burnish their own wealth. So they voted for charlatans who promised them that they’d be special, destroying everything people might have been proud about in the U.K. and replacing it with bile in the process.

I’ve said it before, but it’s like a whole swathe of British society saw the 2012 olympics opening ceremony and the camaraderie of the games and decided it represented everything they hated, and the Tories seized on this.

Youngian wrote: ↑Tue Jul 25, 2023 11:22 am Even David Brent would only say this for a laugh. Frost isn’t really this stupid. Brain dead morons are the only people he has left to back his political ambitions.

No, I think Meatface really is that daft.

Crabcakes wrote: ↑Tue Jul 25, 2023 12:30 pm
Given I fit in that bracket, I can tell you why - we grew up under Thatcher and Major, we saw how society could be better, and then (and I massively generalise here, so apologies) after Blair gifted the right a way back because of his war adventure many of our parents decided they wanted us to be worse off to service their own prejudices or burnish their own wealth. So they voted for charlatans who promised them that they’d be special, destroying everything people might have been proud about in the U.K. and replacing it with bile in the process.

I’ve said it before, but it’s like a whole swathe of British society saw the 2012 olympics opening ceremony and the camaraderie of the games and decided it represented everything they hated, and the Tories seized on this.

Yup.

We grew up in the era of Thatcher and Reagan, and while we enjoyed the consumerism of the 80s, we gave to Live Aid, stayed up late for Saturday Live and Comic Relief, sang Free Nelson Mandela, had this idea that the world was becoming a better place despite the efforts of a few old farts.

The 90s saw an explosion of chill. Conflict suddenly was just not cool. Everyone was invited along for the ride. In retrospect it was a pretty shitty time, but it was a step up from what went before. 1997, May 1st, new and glorious dawn, actual hope, and then in September the first cracks. Pissed Brit punches out a foreigner for not being respectful enough at a Diana shrine. Wins the sympathy of the crowd, and - I think - the judge. Next year, Vindaloo. In 2 short years we've gone from Three Lions to this.

And then the Bradford riots, and soon after some twats fly some planes into things. The warnings were there - Nairobi, Red Sea, Taliban - but we genuinely believed that humanity was on an upward path and things would generally get better.

2012 does seem to be the point where in Britain, the fuckers went "right, fuck you too". I put it at when Osborne got booed. If we looked at the US, we laughed at Sarah Palin (or was it Tina Fey?) and thought we'd never go as low over here. We then had Gamergate and the Reinstate Clarkson movement - the alt-right on manoeuvres and trying out their new tactics.

We were too hopeful, too optimistic, too convinced that everyone else wanted general prosperity and happiness across the board. We were apparently wrong. Still, the pendulum might be swinging back this way, as the populist cunt movement seems to be dying. Or at least we can hope.

I cannot write as eloquently as Crabcakes or Andy, but I have the Open Ceremony saved as a YouTube 'watch again' and I cannot bring myself to actually watch it as I will get upset. For me now, it represents the loss of hope and a future that never was.

As division is in their DNA instead of mutual endeavour, right wing populism is a dead end road. Imagine UKIP and VOX hammering out compromises that improves the lives of Andulicians and Gibraltarians to rub along. And closer to home, name a single Brexiter that has pursued loser consent? Dan Hannan for five hours after the EURef. Meanwhile loser Remainers agonized over how to bring the country together. Thats their death knell, generational changes haven’t shifted the 50-50 divide in Norway whereas no one is turning into a Brexiter on their 50th birthday. Good riddance to bad rubbish.

RandomElement wrote: ↑Tue Jul 25, 2023 2:34 pm I cannot write as eloquently as Crabcakes or Andy, but I have the Open Ceremony saved as a YouTube 'watch again' and I cannot bring myself to actually watch it as I will get upset. For me now, it represents the loss of hope and a future that never was.

I’ve come round to the view over several years that the British state is a moribund and pointless edifice that should be put out of its misery. I don’t see a pitch like 2012 coming along to make me reconsider.

I'm hoping that it's the political equivalent of the Ghost Dance - the remnants of a once-powerful civilisation desperately trying to get back their glory days.

I think he is using alternative facts.

Tubby Isaacs wrote:

So pretty much total bullshit.
From https://www.odyssee-mure.eu/publication ... sport.html

Ah, but even if some of those countries have a higher GDP than us, they're spiritually and culturally poorer...

Free people like to make a judgement as to the best way to get from A to B.

Frosty now on to what the woke secretly want to do. I think Frosty secretly wants to ban football and nice coffee.

Isn't the LNOTP one of our victories though, smuggling in all those EU flags and forcing the audience to wave them and really look like they're enjoying it?

If it wasn’t for the BBC most of the “culture lovers” would never have heard of LNOTP