[Boiler]

Use a cubicle in the men's.

That's not going to fly; the traps in UK city centre businesses are usually disgusting or occupied for narcotic purposes. Or both.

So what do you do if you want to take a dump?

[The Weeping Angel]

Oh Look.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/clyw9qjeq8po

The Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC) has released interim guidance on how organisations should interpret the UK Supreme Court's ruling that a woman is defined by biological sex in law.

The new guidance, external says that, in places like hospitals, shops and restaurants, "trans women (biological men) should not be permitted to use the women's facilities". It also states that trans people should not be left without any facilities to use.

The EHRC said it was releasing interim guidance because "many people have questions about the judgement and what it means for them".

Guidance on when competitive sports can be single-sex will be published in due course, the EHRC said.

Last week the Supreme Court found the terms "woman" and "sex" in the 2010 Equality Act "refer to a biological woman and biological sex".

This means, for instance, that transgender women, who are biologically male but identify as women, can be excluded from women-only spaces.

As part of the judgement, Supreme Court judge Lord Hodge stressed that the law still gives protection against discrimination to transgender people.

The EHRC - which enforces equalities law and provides guidance to policymakers, public sector bodies and businesses - said the impact of the ruling was that "if somebody identifies as trans, they do not change sex for the purposes of the [Equality] Act, even if they have a Gender Recognition Certificate (GRC)".

[Abernathy]

Yes, noted. Do you actually have anything to say?

[The Weeping Angel]

Yes, it's a fair approach to the issue that will get people on both sides frothing at the mouth with rage.

[The Weeping Angel]

[Crabcakes]

Use a cubicle in the men's.

That's not going to fly; the traps in UK city centre businesses are usually disgusting or occupied for narcotic purposes. Or both.

So what do you do if you want to take a dump?

You do what many people pushing for this interpretation of law actually wanted, which is far beyond any notion of safe spaces: you either live with a level of discomfort other people don’t have to, or you don’t go out at all in the first place.

[Crabcakes]

Yes, it's a fair approach to the issue that will get people on both sides frothing at the mouth with rage.

It’s far too simplistic though. A thoughtful, fair approach based on our current (inadequate) law would be, as suggested earlier, to say that single biological sex spaces can now exist without being automatically discriminatory, but they do not *have* to be single biological sex.

This [edit: by this I mean the ECHR interim guidance] is the ‘everything must be labelled’ approach that makes trans people have a third space all the time, thus marking them out. And do we really expect councils, hospitals, schools etc to instantly commence a building programme of third space toilets? Of course not. Slap an extra label on the disabled loos and job done.

[Andy McDandy]

As you said, it's not about solving the problem. Same as asylum seekers in hotels, small boats, and so on. Throw up 'solution' after 'solution', all as half-arsed and half-baked as each other. Get the public reaction moving towards "Oh God, what are the trannies banging on about now, bunch of perverts?". From there it's a small step to "Why can't they all just go away?", and that's it. Job done, next minority group please.

I think, sadly, that we on the left/progressive side, in general, have a greater respect for the truth than the right. We don’t want to lower our standards, and we believe in a level of basic human decency. We also believe that "the truth will out" and everyone will come round to our side naturally. We can't do 100% cynic. That makes us very bad sometimes at dealing with bad faith actors, as we know they're not here to respectfully debate but we still think that if we set a good example they'll follow it.