[davidjay]

British ruling classes finally share the pride and self-confidence of the people themselves.

Half of NI and Scotland and a third of Wales don't believe Britain should exist. The English are rarely asked but did see 49 percent supported an English nation among err Conservative voters.

Because they think England should either colonise the others or stop subsidising them

[Andy McDandy]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/arti ... on_desktop

My buddy Trump's going to come to the rescue of Ukraine.

Any...









Day....









Now?

[Youngian]

Don, Don, Don

[Andy McDandy]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/arti ... on_desktop

Would you believe that no, Trump isn't selling out Ukraine? And it's all the fault of Gordon Brown and David Cameron that we're in this mess now? That no, you didn't hear what you heard from Hesgeth and Vance?

For three years the Ukrainian troops have fought like lions and they are unconquered. They have comprehensively demolished Putin’s propaganda about their country. They have proved their nationhood and their willingness to fight. That patriotism is inextinguishable and in one way or another they will eventually win their freedom. But we must face the reality of this miserable war and its human cost.

And there it is. Well done, plucky little Ukraine. One day you can fight alongside the big boys, but sit down and know your place.

He can’t launch his presidency with a rout for the West and allow Putin to humiliate Nato. He cannot and will not tolerate another Afghanistan, the chaotic implosion of a Western-facing government; and be in no doubt that is what would happen.

If the Kyiv government were to fall, as the result of an unjust peace, and if Putin were to get Ukraine back under his tyrannical thumb – then that whole vast country would erupt in an insurrection that makes Bosnia look like a picnic. The violence would last for decades and the spillover would continue to drag down the world economy for years.

Trump doesn’t want that.

He doesn't care. He seems hell-bent on dismantling NATO.

There's more, but hopefully you get the idea. Johnson's got his eyes on the US and knows who he needs to suck up to. The commentariat aren't having it though. Overwhelmingly calling his bullshit out.

[Youngian]

Let's take a timely look at PM Johnson's views on military strategy and spending just months before Russian tanks headed for Kiev. Where did he formulate these views from; careful extensive research or his Russian oligarch pal whispering in his ear? Duplicatous cunt.

[satnav]

The Ukraine conflict broke out when Johnson was in a great deal of shit domestically, he went all in on supporting Ukraine hoping that being seen as a statesman on the international stage would boost his popularity at home. His gamble failed and he was booted out of office by his own MPs. He continued to support Ukraine after being sacked as PM but now he can see that Trump is keen to appease Putin he has jumped aboard the Trump bandwagon.

[Youngian]

but now he can see that Trump is keen to appease Putin he has jumped aboard the Trump bandwagon.

Isn't he still in a state of denial? Trump will come to the rescue of Ukraine.

[Andy McDandy]

Subtle shift. Gone from save to will do what's best for.

In the "pet dog in chronic pain" sense, I guess.

[Andy McDandy]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/arti ... on_desktop

Cunt says what?

Well, folks, it has been a bad few days for the truth. But yesterday we reached clinical levels of insanity. As I write, the US State Department is demanding that we sandpaper the G7 communique on the third anniversary of the Ukraine war.

Apparently we can no longer ascribe the tragedy to 'Russian aggression'. Oh really? So what was it then?

Always is with you. Anyway, are we inching towards a full-throated denunciation of Trump?

Putin launched his war not because he was worried about Nato – that's pure Kremlin propaganda – but because he is a ruthless opportunist, who had been in power for two decades, and who thought he could revive his political fortunes with a short, sharp war to rebuild the Russian empire.

Right, so it's all on Russia, and it's about Russia and Ukraine and if we hold him off then we've bloodied the bear's nose and stuff?

Right....?

Instead of obfuscating the causes of the war, or pretending there is some nonsensical equivalence between Zelensky and Putin, we need to remember whose side the Ukrainians are on. They are on our side.

They are on the side of freedom. You saw those hideous images of black-scarfed Hamas fighters, whooping and exulting and waving their guns over the pitiful coffin of an Israeli baby. Ask yourself who is paying for the brainwashing of these Islamist killers. Who is funding this nihilistic death cult?

It's the Iranians, of course

WHADDAFUCK?

Whose blessing did Putin obtain before starting this war? Who would be the ultimate beneficiary of any kind of Russian victory – a global proof that you can make war on your neighbour and get away with it? The Chinese, of course

Again, for those at the back, WHADDAFUCK?

Get ready, here it comes...

In this war there is not a shred of moral equivalence between Ukraine and Russia. No one in the US state department believes it and nor – I am absolutely sure – does Donald Trump.

As it happens, I believe this President has the ability to produce peace – peace through strength. I remain optimistic.

Instead of panicking at the bizarre and ahistorical language of the last few days

Ha ha, you silly lefties! You were panicking! It was just us olde and wyse realpolitik meisters playing the long game and getting our foe to wander into our trap!

He needs to stun the Europeans into paying more. He needs to get the Ukrainians to sign the minerals deal, which is now overdue.

Most difficult of all, he must get Putin to come to the table and talk – because it is Putin, now, who has the most to lose from a peace deal.

So, he's managed the most difficult of them already. Remarkable. And the 'overdue minerals deal'? Just fuck off a long pier into a sea of napalm, you custard cunt. Nobody was even talking about a 'minerals deal' a month ago. And you forget that we're part of 'the Europeans' here.

The course of history will be dictated by two giant facts: that the Ukrainians want to be free, and that the US under Donald Trump is committed to a sovereign and independent Ukraine.

That is the right choice because, as Trump knows, the Ukrainian fight is also the fight of the Western world.

Commentariat are having none of it (although there's a significant "not our problem, vote Reform" wedge). Here's a typical high rated comment:

Always making excuses for the guy is not helping either. No world leader should ever have to be interpreted and explained to the masses by someone else. Trump does not have a vision and his only goal is to enrich and empower himself. To suggest otherwise is absurd.

But yes, the cunt is scrabbling on a marble slope and trying to hang on. Just desperate "I know better than you so there" crap.

[Youngian]

Has there been any Trump flirting senior Tory who admitted they were wrong? Country before party, old boy and all that. I suppose that sort of Tory was expunged by Johnson.

[Andy McDandy]

Oh, they're all going with "Western civilisation in the balance, hemisphere before country etc". Besides, Starmer's got no mandate so we're really still in power.

[Bones McCoy]

Classic Dishonest Alexander.

1. Something terrible happened, nuffink to do wiv me guv! (Probably true in this instance)

2. Big boys done and and run away - big boys are Iran and China.

3. It wasn't Donald and Vlad - it looked a bit like them, but I swear they were visiting their girlfriends at the other school.

[davidjay]

Did Johnson really say this?

Trump does not have a vision and his only goal is to enrich and empower himself.

[Andy McDandy]

There's absolutely no connect between the witnessed and documented actions of the Americans, and the scenario Johnson insists is playing out. None at all. Just "See those Hamas people? They're baddies, and you don't want to be a baddie, do you?".

The closest analogy I can think of is if a gang robbed a bank, and when people objected, they pointed out that one account holder with that bank was someone like Gary Glitter. So if you object to the robbery, then you're saying Glitter deserves his money, you massive peed.

Of course, behind all his "It's a dangerous world and we have to be with the US or against it" guff, the real message is clear - "I've hitched my wagon to both of them, and they're diverging, so I'll go with the one with the most money".

The vision/enrichment quote was from a BTL commentator.

[davidjay]

There's absolutely no connect between the witnessed and documented actions of the Americans, and the scenario Johnson insists is playing out. None at all. Just "See those Hamas people? They're baddies, and you don't want to be a baddie, do you?".

The closest analogy I can think of is if a gang robbed a bank, and when people objected, they pointed out that one account holder with that bank was someone like Gary Glitter. So if you object to the robbery, then you're saying Glitter deserves his money, you massive peed.

Of course, behind all his "It's a dangerous world and we have to be with the US or against it" guff, the real message is clear - "I've hitched my wagon to both of them, and they're diverging, so I'll go with the one with the most money".

The vision/enrichment quote was from a BTL commentator.

Ah. I thought it unlikely.

[mattomac]

About time they changed some of those street names.

[Andy McDandy]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/arti ... on_desktop

Fallacious bollocks from someone who claims to have the inside track, but is essentially just a guy writing Trump fanfic.

His critics are wailing that he is on a mission to betray Ukraine, destroy Nato and usher in a might-is-right nightmare, where the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must. Why else would he seem to bully Zelensky and to suggest that Vladimir Putin is an all-round stand-up guy? Why else would he say that Ukraine ‘started the war’?

Much like Andrew Neill's Damascene conversion, it's crap. His critics wail. To want a positive outcome is wishy-washy idealism. They are not Tough and Realistic and Hard and No-Nonsense.

The reason Trump’s approach seems so unfair at present is that no pressure – none whatever – has been exerted on the Russians. But soon the squeeze will be put on the aggressors – and they won’t like it one bit.

Any day now. Soon. Same day as that social care plan is announced and those 40 new hospitals all open.

The last person to answer vaguely to Elon’s Job Description was Jacob Rees-Mogg, whose plan to cut Government excess was sadly axed by Labour. If we want to join the rest of Europe – and spend more on defence – that plan needs reviving.

These investments in British manufacturing can drive jobs, growth and levelling-up – because we have world-beating companies across the UK

Still the same old drivel. Inequalities grew more pronounced after the pandemic. Levelling up was targeted at those who begged best, not those who needed it most. Rees-Mogg's mission was not to reduce waste, but to reinforce top-down order.

Comments BTL aren't buying it. This idea of luring Putin in by giving him everything he wants, then at some undisclosed point the brilliant counterattack will begin and all that pain and suffering will have been worth it - somehow not many people are buying what the custard cunt is selling.

Pity people ever did, because it's all he's ever done.

[Youngian]

Comments BTL aren't buying it. This idea of luring Putin in by giving him everything he wants, then at some undisclosed point the brilliant counterattack will begin and all that pain and suffering will have been worth it - somehow not many people are buying what the custard cunt is selling.

Pity people ever did, because it's all he's ever done.

[Andy McDandy]

From December 2024:

Boris Johnson admits to being 'a bit on the spectrum'

The former PM said it was a "bad thing" that he could not always appreciate how people are feeling, but added that most men were the same.

When asked if he saw himself as a "feeling" person, said: "I'd love to think so. Sometimes. I think sometimes I can be a bit spectrumy probably.

"Like all men, I can sort of zone out and fail to appreciate what people are really feeling, and that's a bad thing.

"Generally speaking, I would say I was as good as the next man at spotting what people are feeling."

He now claims that many people claiming "hard to verify" disability benefits are "having a laugh".

[Andy McDandy]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/arti ... on_desktop

Trump can't let Ukraine down because.....because....look, he just can't!

Vladimir Putin is not interested in peace. He doesn't want to stop the slaughter in Ukraine – or at least, he doesn't want to stop until he has won. He wants to keep bombing and killing.

Pretty basic. Putin's a bad guy.

But the facts speak for themselves.

Unlike the Ukrainians, Putin has not agreed an unconditional ceasefire. He has not stopped his vicious attacks.

Followed by a long and comprehensive list of all the shit Russia has done.

It is obvious that he doesn't want peace – because the conditions that he is setting for that peace are not just ludicrous, but reeking of positive contempt.

After weeks of anguished negotiations, the Ukrainians and the US have put forward a joint plan to stop the carnage. Think what the Ukrainians have accepted – just to get to this point.

Think of the baloney they have endured from their American partners in the hope of coaxing the Russians to the table. They have been forced to listen to a complete mangling of historical reality – the assertion that Ukraine was somehow responsible for 'starting' the war.

So, Ukraine has been forced to endure bullshit from the US, but it was all in a good cause, right? Big long list of all the shit Ukraine has had to eat, from both east and west.

No Ukrainian leader can conceivably agree to these terms, and nor can Donald Trump.

So come on, you classics scholar, how do we cut this Gordian knot?

Will Trump have the guts to really put the squeeze on Putin? I believe he will; and one of the reasons I was always more positive than many about a Trump presidency is that I believe he has the right toughness and negotiating aggression to pull it off.

It is not as though he lacks boldness when it comes to economic warfare. He is being positively beastly to the poor Canadians, long-term allies of the US and more or less blameless. He is threatening punitive economic sanctions – 200 per cent tariffs – on French champagne, for reasons that are not entirely clear.

How utterly crazy it would be if Trump now failed to hit Putin with every shot in his locker, when Putin is flagrantly thumbing his nose at the White House, and continuing his cruel and unnecessary war. How bonkers to clobber America's friends – and let Putin continue literally to get away with murder.

I trust and believe Trump will hit Putin hard, and take further steps to protect a free Ukraine, because he knows in the end he can't betray the legacy of Ronald Reagan. He can't allow a new Iron Curtain to descend on eastern Europe, and a new Russian 'sphere of influence'.

He knows that would mean a general global puncturing of confidence in America – with especially disastrous consequences in the South China Sea.

Above all, he can't allow the world to think Putin has beaten him – and the one thing we all know about Trump is that he doesn't like to lose.

There we have it. Big tough Trump can't possibly be doing - erm, all the things he is doing - because that means he'd be in Putin's pocket. Which he can't be. He's only treating longstanding allies like shit and doing random acts of spite. Must be part of his master plan, which to us mortals is ineffable.

Below the line, they're not convinced. Although this being the Mail, many think he's too wimpy and librul for the new world order.

Duplicitous, craven cunt.